Bogley

Johnlithon · Joined: 29 Aug 2006 Posts: 38 Location: SLC

So yeah I'm planning on heading down to the roost over new years to do Alcatraz and Bluejohn canyons and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for me as I haven't done any winter canyoneering? I know it is kind of a broad question, but anything that you might have picked up over the years that might help a newbie out would be great. Also if you think either canyon would be unwise to do this time of year please let me know.

Thanks :five:

Scott Card · Joined: 07 Dec 2005 Posts: 1503 Location: Provo, Utah

I hope to be just south of you tomorrow. It is forecast to be cold, very cold particularly at night. Days are short, nights are long and cold. I haven't heard about snow or not yet. Take dry cloths through Alcatraz cause you are likely to hit water. Wet suit required I would imagine. Good luck.

shaggy125 · Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 11:15 pm Post subject: Re: Roost Over New Years

Johnlithon wrote: So yeah I'm planning on heading down to the roost over new years to do Alcatraz and Bluejohn canyons and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for me as I haven't done any winter canyoneering? I know it is kind of a broad question, but anything that you might have picked up over the years that might help a newbie out would be great. Also if you think either canyon would be unwise to do this time of year please let me know.

Thanks :five:

Both canyons CAN hold enough water to make things scary in winter, but they might be completely dry. Potholes also might be so frozen over you can walk over them, but then again the ice might break on you. Winter is unpredictable and like Scott said days are short. Also if you get snowed in the roost there are no snow plows to save you. If it were me, I'd stick to North Wash where canyons are almost always bone dry, next to a highway, and still lots of fun, but if you are going to go to North Wash you might as well join Scott and Ram and the crew that will be down there over New Years also (Ram always does an open invite to whoever feels like showing up). They usually do the Black Hole on New Years Day, so thick wetsuit pretty much required. You don't need to do the Black Hole though, you can just hang out with them around the campfire and then do your own thing the next morning. Wherever you go be sure to post pictures.

Eric.

ajroadtrips · Joined: 08 Jul 2005 Posts: 136

Johnlithon wrote: So yeah I'm planning on heading down to the roost over new years to do Alcatraz and Bluejohn canyons and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for me as I haven't done any winter canyoneering? I know it is kind of a broad question, but anything that you might have picked up over the years that might help a newbie out would be great. Also if you think either canyon would be unwise to do this time of year please let me know.

Thanks :five:

I was in the roost earlier in the week. There was snow in patches, with more on the way as I left Wednesday. Roads were snow packed in spots, but fine. Any canyon exits up north facing slickrock could be trouble.

If you encounter any pools, it will be dangerously cold. I would be concerned with Alcatraz without a wetsuit. Sometimes it's dry, sometimes not.

deserthiker

Iceaxe · Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 7793 Location: Local Bordello

I'd suggest skipping Alcatraz in winter. Larry, the Mindbenders and North Fork of Robbers Roost would probably be a much better choice. They might have a little water, but nothing like you might encounter in Alcatraz.

As for Bluejohn.... Main Fork should be dry, Little Blue should be dry and the Ralston route (out Horseshoe) should be dry. The East Fork can hold long sections of deep water.

The Roost is a good place for winter canyons, but you must pick your canyons wisely.

YMMV

:popcorn:

Johnlithon · Joined: 29 Aug 2006 Posts: 38 Location: SLC

Thanks for the info everyone. I was afraid that alcatraz might hold to much water so again thanks for the heads up. I guess we will try one of Iceaxes' suggestions.

Iceaxe · Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 7793 Location: Local Bordello

One other warning.... in the deep tight slots I've noticed the water seldom/never freezes. Do NOT expect to walk across frozen potholes no matter how cold it is outside, I've only been able to do that once (Pandora's) that I can remember. My theory is the tight slots insulate the water and stop it from freezing.

Post a TR when ya get back :2thumbs:

Johnlithon · Joined: 29 Aug 2006 Posts: 38 Location: SLC

Of your suggestions any idea of wich would be the driest?

Iceaxe · Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 7793 Location: Local Bordello

I consider the North Fork of Robbers Roost to be one of the best winter slots around

North Fork of Robbers Roost
http://climb-utah.com/Roost/rrnf.htm

The canyon is really beautiful, but it's to hot to do in summer. It's also technically pretty easy which makes for a good winter slot. No promise that the slot will be dry, but dry is it's normal condition.

goofball · Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:07 pm Post subject:

Iceaxe wrote: I consider the North Fork of Robbers Roost to be one of the best winter slots around

i'll ditto that. and for what it is worth we did this last year this time and it was dry. really pretty canyon.

also, the climb out is not difficult (if you take the right exit) but if any ice has formed it could make it so.

Scott Card · Joined: 07 Dec 2005 Posts: 1503 Location: Provo, Utah

Iceaxe wrote: One other warning.... in the deep tight slots I've noticed the water seldom/never freezes. Do NOT expect to walk across frozen potholes no matter how cold it is outside, I've only been able to do that once (Pandora's) that I can remember. My theory is the tight slots insulate the water and stop it from freezing.

Post a TR when ya get back :2thumbs:

Ditto that about water not freezing in deep thight slots. I was in a couple of swimmers in Trail on Saturday. The pools in the bottom of the canyon were iced over but no ice in the slot itself. Thank goodness for neoprene. TR to follow in the next couple of days.

Johnlithon · Joined: 29 Aug 2006 Posts: 38 Location: SLC

Not much of a TR here, but an update on the conditions in the canyons we did. Sorry no pics I didn't take my camera through the canyons. Little Bluejohn was dry and all webbing looked to be in good condition. Larry Canyon was also completely dry and all webbing here also looked to be in pretty good condition. Road condition were good with snowy patches here and there. Also for anybody who has done Larry Canyon how hard is it to find the "sweet arch" upon exiting the canyon because we couldn't see it.

Again thanks for all the info everyone.

tanya · Joined: 18 Oct 2005 Posts: 5818 Location: Las Vegas

Johnlithon wrote: Not much of a TR here, but an update on the conditions in the canyons we did. Sorry no pics I didn't take my camera through the canyons. Little Bluejohn was dry and all webbing looked to be in good condition. Larry Canyon was also completely dry and all webbing here also looked to be in pretty good condition. Road condition were good with snowy patches here and there. Also for anybody who has done Larry Canyon how hard is it to find the "sweet arch" upon exiting the canyon because we couldn't see it.

Again thanks for all the info everyone.

Nice to hear all went well :2thumbs:

Iceaxe · Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 7793 Location: Local Bordello

Johnlithon wrote: Also for anybody who has done Larry Canyon how hard is it to find the "sweet arch" upon exiting the canyon because we couldn't see it.

The arch is hard to see. I only noticed it the first time through because the sun was shinning perfectly to backlight the wall behind. It is against the east side canyon wall which is about 1/4 mile away.

Little is a relative term... the openning is about 25' I'm guessing.

Here are two crappy pics of the arch.

tanya · Joined: 18 Oct 2005 Posts: 5818 Location: Las Vegas

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

I love it!