Bogley

bryan · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 5

Hey guys,
My wife and I are heading out to southern UT for the first time next week (4/19-26). :five: I've been researching like crazy (this is basically what I do when I'm supposed to be working) but the one thing that's tough to find is early season specific info-- that's where you come in. :haha: For background, we're not very experienced hikers but we're in our late twenties, in pretty good shape and willing to try some more strenuous stuff. Our basic plans are 3 nights Zion, 1 night Boulder, 1 night Torrey, and 2 nights Bryce.

Especially with Zion, I'm having trouble figuring out what to do. I spoke with someone about the Narrows, and apparently it's hit or miss right now with the water flow. And I was really excited when I saw photos of the Subway before I learned you need rappelling experience and guides are not allowed. Is the bottoms-up hike worth it if you've only got three days? I read that the scenery isn't quite so amazing as the top-down.

Near Boulder, I was trying to decide between Calf Creek Falls and Spooky Gulch and the stuff off Hole In the Rock Rd… I think I've decided on Spooky Gulch.

At Capitol Reef, I know we're missing out by only staying one day. But I think Cohab Canyon and Frying Pan sound good. At Bryce, we'll probably just wing it since it seems like a pretty small place.

So any tips on spots to see/avoid this time of year at any of these places? Is Bryce likely to be icy? I do wonder if we should only do one night at Bryce and tack on a night somewhere else.

Thanks in advance,
Bryan

Alex · Joined: 27 Sep 2005 Posts: 2208 Location: SLC, UT

Subway is permitted, so you have to camp the visitor center in early hours to get a permit. If you are going during a week it shouldn't be a problem. You really don't need to have canyoneering skills, there are a couple of handline spots where you can easily downclimb or bring a 40 foot rope with you.

It's very wise to rent the canyoneering shoes and wet suit for subway, you will get very wet and the water is very cold now. You can rent everything from Springdale shop, I forgot the name of it, it's by Pizza place, can't miss it. The shoes will be a life saver for you. (5.10 canyoneers)

You can use the same outfit for Narrows, ask the ranger for the flow on a specific day, if you can make it through Subway, you will easily make it through narrows, it's just a pleasant hike with a couple of deep spots.

Other hikes to consider (none technical) in Zion: Angel's Landing, Overlook point and Emerald Pools.

Win · Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 346 Location: Toquerville

I hope by now you've discovered Tanya and Bo's site, a good reference for this area:

www.zionnational-park.com

For Bryce I would suggest the Fairyland Loop or go in the Queens Garden and connect to the Peekaboo Loop coming out at Navajo. Both are good "in the canyon" hikes.

If you're going down Hole in the Rock make sure to spend some time in the Devil's Garden, you'll pass right by it.

In Zion make sure you do Angel's Landing and Observation Pt. Both are classic Zion hikes. Start early! Check at Zion Adventure for Narrows info, water flow is a bit high and it will be cold. They'll rent you the right gear.

Make sure you get up on the East Side of Zion and do one of the drainages. Tanya has the Beta for Many Pools or Two Pines on her site. There are several others.

You're staying in Boulder so be sure to take a drive down the Burr Trail, in fact you can go down it and into Capitol Reef, head North on Notom Rd and exit just East of Torrey. You may want an SUV for this.

Have fun.

Win

tanya · Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:14 am Post subject:

These guys have it covered... for Zion and Bryce. Do you have any questions?

Cirrus2000 · Joined: 26 Mar 2006 Posts: 978 Location: Vancouver, BC

Alex wrote:
It's very wise to rent the canyoneering shoes and wet suit for subway, you will get very wet and the water is very cold now. You can rent everything from Springdale shop, I forgot the name of it, it's by Pizza place, can't miss it. The shoes will be a life saver for you. (5.10 canyoneers)

Actually, that location of the Zion Adventure Company (http://www.zionadventures.com/) is closed for renovations right now. They're open in the new building, though, up on Lion Blvd. (Their website needs updating!). Beautiful new place.
Alex wrote:
Other hikes to consider (none technical) in Zion: Angel's Landing, Overlook point and Emerald Pools.
Angels Landing is fantastic. If you're scared of heights and inexperienced, it may be a little daunting, but doable. Overlook Point is quick and easy, and quite nice. Observation Point is another good one, though fairly strenuous. Something I like to do is just park somewhere on the east side of the tunnel, and start walking up the drainages that Win mentioned... With or without previous info, it's fun to do.

Lower Calf Creek Falls is a nice hike, but fairly short - what I did was to do it as a drive-by at the end of the day. Arrived at the trailhead a couple of hour before dark, then reached the falls just before sunset. Walked back in the twilight, and reached the lot just before needing my headlamp.

If you're doing Spooky, do the whole Peekaboo/Spooky loop. From Tom's site: http://canyoneeringusa.com/utah/esca/drycoy.htm

I have mixed feelings about Bryce. It's truly stunning to look at, but I think you'd probably be happy with a day there. I was sated after about 4 hours - but very glad I went!

OK, while I was typing this (and eating breakfast), Win and Tanya posted, so there's some redundancy, but I'll still hit "Submit"!

Alex · Joined: 27 Sep 2005 Posts: 2208 Location: SLC, UT

Didn't know that about the renting place, thanks for heads up! :2thumbs:

I loved Bryce when I was there, and I did spend a couple of days in the inn within the park. We did the whole big loop, whatever the name of it is...?

But the neato part about Bryce is the Sunrise! We got up at 5am and were sitting on the edge waiting for the sun to appear, what a beautiful site! I'd also recommend taking a helicopter ride to see Bryce.

stefan · Joined: 09 Jan 2006 Posts: 3601 Location: somewhere

Alex wrote: Subway is permitted, so you have to camp the visitor center in early hours to get a permit.

though technically they do not allow you to camp at the permit office. if you need to hang out, you must make it look as though you're not "camping"

trackrunner · Joined: 27 Nov 2007 Posts: 511

Win wrote: I hope by now you've discovered Tanya and Bo's site, a good reference for this area:

www.zionnational-park.com

For Bryce I would suggest the Fairyland Loop or go in the Queens Garden and connect to the Peekaboo Loop coming out at Navajo. Both are good "in the canyon" hikes.

If you're going down Hole in the Rock make sure to spend some time in the Devil's Garden, you'll pass right by it.

In Zion make sure you do Angel's Landing and Observation Pt. Both are classic Zion hikes. Start early! Check at Zion Adventure for Narrows info, water flow is a bit high and it will be cold. They'll rent you the right gear.

Make sure you get up on the East Side of Zion and do one of the drainages. Tanya has the Beta for Many Pools or Two Pines on her site. There are several others.

You're staying in Boulder so be sure to take a drive down the Burr Trail, in fact you can go down it and into Capitol Reef, head North on Notom Rd and exit just East of Torrey. You may want an SUV for this.

Have fun.

Win
Everyone has pretty much covered it. I would second Angle's Landing & Observation point in that order. Both are classic and Angle's Landing IMO is the most iconic hike in Zion. If you are afraid of heights these trails are not for you. 1400 ft drop off on the east side & 800 ft drop on the west side of Angle's Landing. Trail is as narrow as 3 ft wide and only one small chain for up and down traffic to use as a crutch. An early start is important to beat the heat but for Angle's Landing it is really important so the trail isn't too crowded (beat the crowds). Three weeks ago there were too many people on the trail by 11:00 AM to safely pass on the narrow ridge, thankfully no one died.

Another easy hike but iconic is Emerald Pools. On the east side there is the canyon overlook trail. It is only a mile round trip so an hour max is needed. Combine this with Win’s suggestion of doing something off trail on the east side there is some neat stuff out there.

If you make it to the Kolob Canyons section (I would recommend the other stuff first over this part) I would suggest Taylor Creek (middle fork) to the double alcove arch. South fork of Taylor Creek is an easy short hike along social trails. You don’t have enough time to do the La Verkin Creek trail out to Kolob Arch. Again I’d recommend the main canyon and east side stuff over Kolob Canyons if you are pressed for time and it is your first time visiting, but that IMO.
:rockon:

bryan · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 5

Thanks for the tips everybody. I'll be sure to add Burr Trail and the east Zion drainages to the list.

Looking at some pics of Angel's Landing, I think I'm going to go up to scout's lookout and make the call from there. Just looking at some of those pics makes my palms sweat!

I'm definitely going to look into the Subway some more-- it looks incredible. I had kind of ruled it out since some websites make it sound somewhat technical.

tanya · Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:24 am Post subject:

The photos make Angels Landing look far worse than it is.

Cirrus2000 · Joined: 26 Mar 2006 Posts: 978 Location: Vancouver, BC

tanya wrote: The photos make Angels Landing look far worse than it is.
Agreed - set aside enough time to do the whole thing, and just keep going until you can't anymore. I'm sure you'll make it to the top. Concentrate on what's in front of you, hold the chains (if needed), and don't look off to the side if it spooks you. One step at a time...

trackrunner · Joined: 27 Nov 2007 Posts: 511

Cirrus2000 wrote: tanya wrote: The photos make Angels Landing look far worse than it is.
Agreed - set aside enough time to do the whole thing, and just keep going until you can't anymore. I'm sure you'll make it to the top. Concentrate on what's in front of you, hold the chains (if needed), and don't look off to the side if it spooks you. One step at a time...
That is why I think an early start with no crowds is important. You'll be able to go at your own pace and not be forced to move on those narrow platforms because of the crowds.

It is defiantly worth the hike; you'll have an amazing view of the canyon at the top.

Get an early start, go slow and use the chains even if you’re nervous. If you are the type of person that pisses/sh**s your pants because of the height once you’re on the ridge turn around, the hike isn't for you. I have never met a person that was nervous and finished the hike say “I regretted pushing on.”

Win · Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 346 Location: Toquerville

With Angel's Landing, you'll know as soon as you hit the chains if you'll do it or not. I did this in 2003 at 59 and did not have a problem, my wife has still not done it. Only you can decide. Scout's Lookout is still a great place and from there you can venture up the West Rim Trail bit.

Win

RedRoxx · Joined: 07 Jan 2007 Posts: 76 Location: Tucson Az

Near Boulder Upper Calf Creek falls is a shorter scenic hike then you can wade bushwack down almost to upper falls. Lower is pretty nice if not on a day with a busload of kids.
Off Hole in the Rock Spooky and Peek a Boo are fun, but I like the hike and photography better at Zebra and Tunnel slots. Again, can be very busy if on a weekend.
Bryce I concur, can see and do most of what you want in a day.
Zion is special, and deserves more time.

deathcricket · Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 442 Location: St George

Yeah bro! You're going to love Zion. I would put Subway and Angel's landing to the top of your list. If you do go on a crowded day, hit up "hidden canyon" that one is never crowded and one of my faves also. There is a little mini arch and some great rocks to scramble on. I went 3 weeks ago and there was still quite a bit of snow in there too. So should be nice and cool since it's starting to heat up.

Check your private message, I sent you a map for Subway, just in case. Navigation in the beginning is a little tricky and getting lost eats up your whole day. Well it did for me anyways.
:lol8:

Oh yeah weeping rock! Only takes 15 mins and is well worth the short walk.