Bogley

[Sombeech]

[gootwan]

Cool video... but am I mistaken or did I see that dude rigging an auto block before rapping down a waterfall? Is that safe?

Jordan

[Scott Card]

gootwan wrote: Cool video... but am I mistaken or did I see that dude rigging an auto block before rapping down a waterfall? Is that safe?

Jordan
Good question. Looks like he was having trouble in the waterfall, maybe not, but it seems that would not be a good idea. If I saw correctly, he had a prussik next to his harness and has extended his Piranha with a tether. Ok oh Gurus. A little help here..... (this is why I need these canyoneering courses)

I'll go out on a limb and tell you what I would do in this canyon. It didn't look like the hydraulics were that bad so I would have never put an auto block on my set up. I would have gone normally, piranha attached to biner attached to harness - no tether and if I was nervous about anything, I would be nervous about getting tangled in the rope or stuck in a bad hydraulic. Therefore, I may have had a sheath knife on my leg strap just in case. Drowning scares me almost as much as falling. OK, critique away. (please) Thanks Beech for the video.

[rcwild]

gootwan wrote: Cool video... but am I mistaken or did I see that dude rigging an auto block before rapping down a waterfall? Is that safe?

Jordan

No, it's not safe. Hope they at least rigged a releasable system at the top. If not – sooner or later – someone's gonna drown.

[trackrunner]

rcwild wrote: gootwan wrote: Cool video... but am I mistaken or did I see that dude rigging an auto block before rapping down a waterfall? Is that safe?

Jordan

No, it's not safe. Hope they at least rigged a releasable system at the top. If not – sooner or later – someone's gonna drown.
I may not be as experienced as Rich, but even in my noobish I know self belay knot in current is not the smartest move. Granted the current didn’t look too strong. Please correct me if I’m wrong but two problems I've heard of could be the knot tightening in the waterfall and the canyoner sucking down water. Or submerging into the pool and the knot tightening making it hard to surface and get air. Are there others?

[alusul]

trackrunner wrote: Please correct me if I’m wrong but two problems I've heard of could be the knot tightening in the waterfall and the canyoner sucking down water. Or submerging into the pool and the knot tightening making it hard to surface and get air. Are there others?

Think thats about right, other then some small variation like simply letting go and having it tighten and then gargling water, or doing some foolish attempt at self rescue when stuck (maybe not so foolish if you have an ATS guy up top and no releasable anchor) and simply cutting loose and falling early.

Though I'm not sure what you mean by submerging in the water and not getting up, I think you're just leaving out getting twisted up in the rope when trying to go off rope and being unable to stay at the surface.

Overall, I've tried to find some reason one might pass money to these ATS folks for a class, and I've been unsuccessfull so far :ne_nau:

[trackrunner]

alusul wrote:
Though I'm not sure what you mean by submerging in the water and not getting up, I think you're just leaving out getting twisted up in the rope when trying to go off rope and being unable to stay at the surface.


You are right I don't think it would be a problem now. I was thinking if the knot tighten while you were underwater in the pool it might be hard to surface but you would be able to swim to the surface. I think I got it confussed with your example of getting twisted up in the rope.

[m cabourne]

The canyon shown is Little Santa Anita, a short canyon above Sierra Madre in the San Gabriels. Even with the water shown, I don't believe it would be considered much of a class C canyon. When I took ATS courses 4 years ago, auto blocks were not taught to be used routinely and certainly not in canyons with significant water flow. I'm not sure what is taught now but I doubt they would consider this appropriate in class C canyons.

When this canyon is really pumping, the water shown in the first rappel shoots out to the over hanging rock in the background and hydraulics are a real issue in the pools below. Right now the biggest danger is from rockfall in the canyon and climbing the barbed wire fence at the canyon exit.

[rcwild]

http://www.canyoneering.net/forums/showthread.php?t=481